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Barry Nussbaum: Hello and welcome to ATP Report. We are very honored and thrilled to have a very special guest with us back today. Dr. Bill Warner is the founder of the Center for Study of Political Islam and, based on decades of research, is here to announce a new movement that he is developing. Welcome, Dr. Bill.

Dr. Bill Warner: My goodness, Barry. It sounds like we should have had a drum roll.

Barry Nussbaum: Or at least a marching band. Right? So, we've been talking before we went on air. Dr. Bill, tell us about what you're developing and why it's so important today.

Dr. Bill Warner: Well, I was talking with one of my students in Central Europe, and she was saying that it was difficult for them to get in to see the right people, but that Muslims could go see these right people, these are government officials, any time they wanted to.

I said, “Well if they let Muslims come in to see them, what about former Muslims?” The idea of a light bulb goes on in my head, and she says, “Well, I've never heard of that.” I've never heard of it either. But I said it's a question that needs to be asked. I already knew what the fate of the apostate was from my study of Islam, and it is not good, is it?

Barry Nussbaum: Let's start with that, Bill. Why is being an apostate from Islam so dangerous and sometimes to the point of your family, your life, your job, your integration, or lack thereof in society? It's like you've committed mass murder, but you didn't kill anybody. Can you explain?

Dr. Bill Warner: Actually, it's worse than mass murder because being an apostate is the worst sin of all. This goes back to the days of, guess what, Mohammed and Allah. The crime says that those who leave Islam can be killed.

There are several Hadith little short stories about Mohammed who also says that apostates can be killed, as a matter of fact, should be killed. So, the reason that apostates can be killed is if Allah says so, so does Mohammed. Now, when Mohammed died, the first caliph that is the ruler of Islam was Abu Bakr Abubakar.

The first business was not to preach more about Islam but instead to declare war against those who wanted to leave Islam. Because many of the Muslims said, “Well, you know, we had a deal with Mohammed. It was good while it lasted, but we're out of here.” He said, “No, you're not leaving and if you try to, I'll kill you.”

These are known as the media wars, the apostasy wars. So that's how Islam started. It was killing apostates. That was his first foreign policy. That is, it declared that anybody who was an apostate was a foreigner and could be killed because it creates- it’s the worst, it is considered the worst crime because it creates chaos within the community.

One of the great sheiks from Al-Azhar University said, “Listen to this. If it were not for the apostasy laws, Islam would cease to exist.” How important is that?

Barry Nussbaum: That tells you it's like the Hotel California song by the Eagles, “You can check-in, but you can't check out.” It's a one-way mouse trap.

Dr. Bill Warner: It is indeed. “You can check out any time you want, but you can never leave.”

Barry Nussbaum: So, what's historically so unusual about Islam today?

Dr. Bill Warner: Well, we're at a unique time in history. I love to study history, and one of the ways we're living in an important time is this is the first time in 1400 years that the common man, the ordinary man, the blessed bus driver, the plumber can read and understand Islamic doctrine, which was always under the purview of serious scholars.

But now anybody can do it. The other thing is, for the first time in history, apostates, former Muslims are speaking out in a public way. Here's Andy Serwer. So, there are many others. I've done two interviews recently with other women who left, Islam, and they are anxious to speak to the world.

So, these two new things that anyone can understand the doctrine when I say that the apostates should be killed. You can go read it yourself in the Hadith, in the Quran. And so, anyone can learn this, and anyone can see what the fate of the apostate is, and I don't know of anybody, even my most liberal friends, who would say kill the apostates, that just wouldn't happen.

Barry Nussbaum: So, it's an important day, the words, it sounds like you're a crazy man, I mean, truly crazy, and yet we both know what you're saying is one hundred percent true and accurate around the world. It's happening right now in most major countries, east, and west. So why are we losing our war against political Islam? What could ex-Muslims do, as you call it, to be a secret weapon?

Dr. Bill Warner: Well, they’re a secret weapon because of this. When I say something about Islam, you can always say Dr. Bill doesn't know anything. He's a crazy old professor. You have to be a Muslim to know Islam. As a matter of fact, since you're not a Muslim that is proof that you don't understand Islam. The argument goes, if you reject Islam, then you don't understand it. That's because it's the most perfect way of life. So, there we have that.

Barry Nussbaum: Well, in today's world, it's Muslims, as you said, that is the enemy, and carrying on the tradition from 1500 years ago. They are the worst enemies. How are Muslims being treated today in the U.S. and Europe, just basically ignored?

Dr. Bill Warner: Well, let's take, for example, the FBI. The FBI hires Arab translators and Farsi translators, but they never hire former Muslims as translators. As a matter of fact, they won't even accept anybody but Muslims. So that's how they're treated. They're ignored.

But in my opinion, who knows Islam the best an apostate knows it best because they've been both in the CAFO world and they've been in the Muslim world. So, they're the ones that you should be doing the translation for the FBI and CIA, and NSA. There are other jobs like this. Let me give an example of how it's not done and how it should be done here in Tennessee.

We've got a new Governor who calls himself a conservative, and he needed to train the state law enforcement. Did he confirm with me? Nope. Did he turn anybody but the Muslim Brotherhood? So, the Muslim Brotherhood appeared in front of law enforcement and basically said Islam is a religion of peace.

These people who are Muslims who do bad things, they're not really Muslims, blah, blah, blah. Fine, let them say that. But what should come after that is that former Muslims should stand up and say their view of Islam.

So, therefore, law enforcement gets to hear not only the believer's side but the doubter side as well. That is, they will understand the whole picture. So, that's very important because I've discovered that anybody when they hear the whole story and can believe it, they reject it.

Barry Nussbaum: Well, you know, it reminds me what I just listen to you about the Governor in Tennessee after 9/11, Bill, after very devout religious Muslims carried out the most horrific terror attack in American history on American soil.

President George Bush, for weeks and weeks and weeks and weeks, was making the speech religion of peace. Islam is a religion of peace. The hijackers were not true Muslims, and on and on and on, as if somebody gave him a different copy of the Quran than I had read and you have read, which told them the hijackers, that what they did was perfect under the rules of the religion.

So, my question, I guess, is what do we do when all of these governments and I mean from the very top in the White House, Governors and so on, have this idea in their head that the only source of reliable information about the religion are the apologists for the religion and anybody that's left that speaks out. Well, they're Islamophobic, Bill.

Dr. Bill Warner: You're a racist, hater, bigot, Islamophobia, that's what you're called.

Barry Nussbaum: Exactly.

Dr. Bill Warner: Islam has a strange idea, that only those who practice it can understand it. That's not true of the Democratic Party, the Republican Party, or Christianity or anything else that is, don't you? Look, the basis for Islam is Mohammed, and we have his biography.

Don't tell me that I can't read a biography and understand it. I mean, just that's just B.S. here. So there. But what happens is, is that I have to overcome that barrier, whereas the former Muslim can't be told you don't understand Islam. So, therefore, what's difficult is, see, I thought when you printed the truth, that people would want to hear the truth. That's just simply not the case.

Barry Nussbaum: How naive.

Dr. Bill Warner: I was very naive because what happened was the Muslim Brotherhood after 9/11 started spending money and getting appointments with public relations firms and other such people. So, they went to see the governors, they went to see their senators, they went to see the congressmen and when someone like me comes along, we can't get in the door.

So, the nice thing about a former Muslim is, is that they have to be believed because they know that they were there, and therefore they can be seen as truth-tellers, even in the marketplace of ideas of the government.

Barry Nussbaum: Well, Bill, I hope you're right. This is the discussion that we're not going to solve today, but we're going to have you back. Thanks for coming on today and all of you out there that haven't yet subscribed. I want to remind you again. Please take out your cell phone, text the word TRUTH to 88202.

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